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[~Maverick~]

This match is Bizox (Geoffrey) vs. LinkHasAFan (Muarium). Anyone who is not listed there may not post. You can, however, post in the main FEDC thread. The only (obvious) exception is myself, because I have to make the threads.

Rules

1. Only the people who are debating can comment on the other's posts. It's a debate between two people, a one on one, not everybody gang up on one person.

2. No flaming/personal attacks. I know this is a debate, and you can argue, just don't insult them because they like so-and-so or insult their facts. Prove them wrong, bring up facts of your own, no personal attacks. Sarcasm is okay, proving their strategy complicated is okay, redirecting them to your answer a few posts back is okay, but no personal attacks.

3. No edits. We don't know what you had before if that happens. I don't care if it's a typo, or inaccurate information. If that happens, quote, and edit it that way. It won't count as one of your posts, so just put edit after you quote it.

4. Don't spam or knowingly provide false information. Back up your claims with facts. Provide stats or strategies.

5. Anyone who is not in the debate, you can PM the judges your comments on the debate. Send it to all three, by separating their names with commas and then a space. Judges will take those comments into consideration when deciding the winner of the match.

6. No comments by anyone who is not debating. This makes the debate unfair, as you could potentially give one side ammunition and discourage debaters, which is not the purpose of this thread. Comments can be sent to the judges.

7. Have fun. This does not include posting if you are not supposed to.

Time Frame

1. The match will last so that each person has up to 3 days between each post, and each person is allowed 3 posts apiece. However, the first post will be given a time limit of 4 days, because Mavvy is unreliable with times he posts, and because they have to write from scratch. The longest a debate can last is 19 days, if people take 3 days to post their response.

2. The person listed first will go first, and is also the person listed on the top or closer to the left on the bracket.

[Linkhasafan]

Bump so Bizox notices.

[Bizox]

Sorry, I nearly forgot. <<;

Alright, we have the biggest beast in the game, Geoffrey.

Seriously, look at this:



Can't you just hear the fangirls sighing? Pin-up material, right thar.

Why use Geoff, you may ask? Why is more awesome than Muarim? First of all, he's got the best class in the game, hands down. Two weapons, horsey, high movement, he's got it all. Even if every other Paladin in the game is as usable as Geoff, might as well use him, simply because Paladin is an awesome class. Muarim, on the other hand, has a class that has to rely on items even to be able to fight all the time. He needs to either use a stat-hindering Demi Band, which would be better off in another laguz's hands anyways, or use hard-to-come-by laguz stones, or he can't even fight all the time. Classwise, Geoff smites Muarim into the ground like the puny little boy he is on the inside. Only a puny little boy would wear a bandana and be friends with an even punier little boy like Tormod.

Geoff will likely have a slight level lead over the rest of your units to begin with, coming in during Ch. 25 at Level 11. But it only gets better from there. He has Paragon, which means he'll get to 20 probably before anyone else. He has pretty damn good growths in some key areas, including 50% in Strength, 55% in Skill and Speed, and 45% in Defense and Resistance. It's true that he only has mediocre bases, but he has an A in lances to begin with, so he can use Silver Lances to make up for his shortcomings. As well, those growths will pad these deficiencies when it's all said and done. Though Paragon is a 15-point skill, he'll cap off fast enough that you can remove it quickly and give him Sol or Resolve, which would both be good for Geoff. And 21 base defense for a Paladin? Geoff would make a better president than Hillary or Obama with defense like that. The Twin Towers wouldn't have fallen if you put Geoff in front of them. Homeland Defense? Psh, just clone Geoff a few million times and line the border with them. Suddenly we have the best army in the world.

Muarim? Well, he'll grow slowly due to him being both a laguz and not available to fight half the time. Sure, you could give him the Demi Band. But there are units that could better use it. Por ejemplo, Mordecai has been around for longer, so has gained a fair amount of experience, and has better overall potential than Muarim, statwise. Mordecai is a clearly better choice if you must use a laem-ass laguz, and both are smited into the ground by Ranulf once he arrives. Ranulf makes better use of the Demi Band than both of them. Mordecai has superior supports, and bases similar in some stats to Muarim's despite the 7 levels between them, and have similar growths. So they'll end up similar statwise, and Mordecai's superior supports will put him over the top until Ranulf arrives, who is arguably better than any other laguz in the game due to /really/ superior supports and higher speed stats than most other laguz. And Ranulf's just awesome. He doesn't wear a bandana, he wears a funky hat. Fo srs.

Supports. To be honest, both fall rather short in this respect. Muarim has Largo, Lethe, and Zihark. All of them are rather long supports, and out of those units, Zihark is the only one worth fielding, and barely so. Zihark has better options, anyways. Swordmasters fail in this game, other than Stefan.

Geoff, on the other hand, has Calill and Elincia. Calill is, at the very least, a halfdecent Sage with high weapon levels all around. She's worth fielding as a utility unit for chapters where you could use extra mages, which in all honesty, is just about every chapter since enemies have collectively low resistance. As well, more and more dragons appear later in the game, and that B in Thunder magic can be made to an A or even an S rather easily, which'll be a big help to Illyana so she won't have to handle the Dragons on her own. Calill is worth fielding for sure, and though it may not be a definite A support, it can, at the very least, be a halfway decent support helping both of these useful units.

So in conclusion, Muarim tried to destroy the Geoff, but the Geoff had his way. Muarim then tried to dethrone the Geoff, but Geoff was in the way. Muarim tried to destroy the Geoff, but the Geoff was much too strong. Muarim tried to defile the Geoff, but Muarim was proven wrong.

And seriously, who wears a bandana?

[Linkhasafan]

Ok first off I want to point out something, Muriam has a 10% critical support with Tormod, sure Tormod starts low, but he's a good mage. Like Soren, maybe not as good, but he's good.

Secondly I want to ask you, why the hell Geoffry? He SUCKS compared to other paladins. Oscar, Kieran, and he appears so late in the game. Sure he comes with a Brave Lance, but Muriam comes with a Demi Band. Holy crap! They don't even compare, a Demi Band is way more useful then a Brave Lance, it doesn't break after 10, 4 combination attacks V_V

I also want to point something else out, Geof has Elincia protect him. What a wuss!

Also I want to say that Muriam is a Laguz, if you had to, you could give him BEXP to level 20 and have him pimped out in the first half of the game! A total tank to choose for.

Now I know there's a stronger tiger, Mordecai,

Mordecai's Growth Rates:
Hp:150 Str:65 Mag:0 Skl:55 Spd:50 Luck:40 Def:40 Res:20

While Muriam's Growth Rates:
Hp:145 Str:70 Mag:5 Skl:70 Spd:55 Luck:35 Def:60 Res:25

Now check that out, Muriam kicks Mordecai's butt big time in everything besides HP and Luck by 5!

Geoffry's Growth Rates:
Hp:65 Str:50 Mag:25 Skl:55 Spd:55 Luck:20 Def:45 Res:45

Besides Magic and Resistence, Muriam still kicks his butt!

Geof would be down for the count in two hits.

[Bizox]

Ok first off I want to point out something, Muriam has a 10% critical support with Tormod, sure Tormod starts low, but he's a good mage. Like Soren, maybe not as good, but he's good.

A great poet once compared Tormod to a pile of dog "I'm in violation of the code of conduct, I should re-read and make sure I do not swear on the forums anymore" with red dye in it. The only mage/sage he's potentially better than is Bastian, who a great poet compared to a pile of "I'm in violation of the code of conduct, I should re-read and make sure I do not swear on the forums anymore" circa 1500. Soren, Illyana, hell, even Calill all aren't nearly as underleveled. There's no need for 4 mages. As a mage, you don't need to be good, you just need to be passing. Why? Because they attack resistance, which is typically low for enemies, and are typically speedy. There are 3 passable mage/sages in this game, and there's Rhys as well, why is Tormod even mentioned in the same sentence paragraph full-scale novel as any of the others? Tormod isn't worth the BEXP and the babying when you have other units.

Secondly I want to ask you, why the hell Geoffry? He SUCKS compared to other paladins. Oscar, Kieran, and he appears so late in the game. Sure he comes with a Brave Lance, but Muriam comes with a Demi Band. Holy crap! They don't even compare, a Demi Band is way more useful then a Brave Lance, it doesn't break after 10, 4 combination attacks V_V

Who gives a damn if he appears late in the game? He's on par level-wise, has the best defenses of any of the paladins (20+ DEF base? BEAST.), and will hit Lv. 20 ridiculously fast thanks to Paragon. He'll kill with consistency thanks to having that Brave Lance. And considering he has the strength not to have to attack 4 times for the kill, it's not 10 attacks, then gone. He just has the luxury of being able to attack twice in a row before the enemy can attack, or if he misses once or twice he can still get the kill. The Demi Band reduces stats and is better off in someone else's hands besides Muarim's anyways.

I also want to point something else out, Geof has Elincia protect him. What a wuss!

Muarim wears a bandana. Who wears a bandana?

Besides, Geoff protects Elincia, not the other way around. Might as well protect someone as bangin' as Elincia, Geoff could pimp his way into royalty if he wanted.

Also I want to say that Muriam is a Laguz, if you had to, you could give him BEXP to level 20 and have him pimped out in the first half of the game! A total tank to choose for.

k, you go waste all the BEXP in the game getting Muarim to 20. I'll use it on my healers so they don't promote as late as they do. Half the levels, half the experience gained, and that includes BEXP. Laguz wtfail.

Now check that out, Muriam kicks Mordecai's butt big time in everything besides HP and Luck by 5!

If Mordecai's fielded, he'll have a level lead. He's got great bases to begin with, so by the time you get Muarim, you'll notice that Mordecai has better stats, better supports, and is a better candidate for Muarim's Demi Band, so even if Muarim's growths really were that much better than Mordecai's, (which they're really not,) it would hardly matter. And considering that there's only 20 levels for Laguz to grow, growths matter less in the first place.

Geoffry's Growth Rates:
Hp:65 Str:50 Mag:25 Skl:55 Spd:55 Luck:20 Def:45 Res:45

Besides Magic and Resistence, Muriam still kicks his butt!

Beorc have less growth by default because they'll naturally gain more stats because of gaining more levels. They give Laguz higher growths because they get half the level ups.

As well, Muarim is busy not even being able to fight half the time, or taking stat penalties because of using the Demi Band. Besides, Geoff has great bases to begin with, has horsey utility, the ability to gain more levels in stats, halfway-existent supports, and all that.

Geof would be down for the count in two hits.

Geoff just needs to take off his shirt, and everyone in the building's down for the count.

[Linkhasafan]

I want to say first, this isn't a Tormod vs Geof debate, it's a Muriam vs Geof debate. If it was a Tormod vs Geof debate, I would give up now!

Ok anyways, half your stuff don't prove anything or make sence... :\ Ok to make this paragraph to make sence I'll say something that makes sence. For people like me who save their BEXP for a while, it's good to go and waste some before the end of the game. So Muriam is a good chance. I mean, when I played through my second time, I gave Muriam about enough BEXP to get him to level 15, then he wipped out enemies to level 20! I over looked him at first, but he seriously is awesome! Go and kick Geof's butt any day.

Ok for my level section, you have plenty of time to level up Muriam to level 20. For Geof you start late, but obviously you hate that fact. So um...Well what I have to say about Geof is, he has only a couple levels before total level, giving barely any time to get his caps and barely and any real stat growth. Talk about L7 (I hate that term, but you know =P)

So I wanna talk about this quote of yours "As well, Muarim is busy not even being able to fight half the time, or taking stat penalties because of using the Demi Band. Besides, Geoff has great bases to begin with, has horsey utility, the ability to gain more levels in stats, halfway-existent supports, and all that." I have to disagree. You have barely any time at all to get A support, and also he has about 4-6 levels to gain (I forgot ^_^; ) so that's really not much stat gain...at all.

To start off this paragraph, Ranulf wears one, go dis him instead. So what if he wears a Demiband, the Brace Lance is gone in 10, 4 combo hits! Talk 'bout a waste, the Demiband stays on as long as you have it equiped and so what if he loses a couple stats, who says he HAS to wear the band?

Muriam kicks butt, *covers eyes* PUT BACK ON GEOF'S SHIRT!

This post has been edited by Linkhasafan: Jan 29 2008, 07:11 PM

[Bizox]

I want to say first, this isn't a Tormod vs Geof debate, it's a Muriam vs Geof debate. If it was a Tormod vs Geof debate, I would give up now!

You brought Tormod into this by saying that he's a decent support for Muarim. Ergo, I had to shoot that down mercilessly.

Ok anyways, half your stuff don't prove anything or make sence... :\ Ok to make this paragraph to make sence I'll say something that makes sence. For people like me who save their BEXP for a while, it's good to go and waste some before the end of the game. So Muriam is a good chance. I mean, when I played through my second time, I gave Muriam about enough BEXP to get him to level 15, then he wipped out enemies to level 20! I over looked him at first, but he seriously is awesome! Go and kick Geof's butt any day.

Actually, it's your 'debate material,' if that's what you call it, that didn't make much sense or prove anything.

Muarim doesn't deserve a point of BEXP. Underleveled units and healers, who can't gain experience too well, are the main recipients of BEXP. Rhys, for example. He'll promote ridiculously late if you don't give him his share of BEXP. And that's your own personal experience that you save BEXP. That's not statistically supported, or wise at all for that matter. The only thing that belongs in a courtroom debate is evidence statistics.

I'm still waiting for the thing you were going to say that was supposed to make sense, btw.

Ok for my level section, you have plenty of time to level up Muriam to level 20. For Geof you start late, but obviously you hate that fact. So um...Well what I have to say about Geof is, he has only a couple levels before total level, giving barely any time to get his caps and barely and any real stat growth. Talk about L7 (I hate that term, but you know =P)

Why cap stats when he can kill units very easily without capping stats? 20+ defense for a Paladin? Easily passable stats everywhere else? Beast. More than Muarim. Muarim's only a half-beast, lol.

And... I hate that fact? No, it's just completely meaningless that he comes in late due to his Paragon skill. He'll have a level lead for most of the last few chapters.

I have to disagree. You have barely any time at all to get A support, and also he has about 4-6 levels to gain (I forgot ^_^; ) so that's really not much stat gain...at all.

He has plenty of time. The game realizes that Geoff joins late, so they make his supports shorter. And get it through your head: He already has loads of stats. He doesn't need to gain that many stats.

To start off this paragraph, Ranulf wears one, go dis him instead. So what if he wears a Demiband, the Brace Lance is gone in 10, 4 combo hits! Talk 'bout a waste, the Demiband stays on as long as you have it equiped and so what if he loses a couple stats, who says he HAS to wear the band?

No, Ranulf wears a funny myrmidon hat. So I'll continue to diss Muarim. And I've been over this already. Geoff has the strength so that he very rarely has to use all 4 hits that he'll get from Brave Lances. Only a high-defense, high-HP unit will require 4 hits from a Brave Lance to kill. He has to wear the band to be useable 100% of the time, since he'll be in human form half the time if he doesn't have the Demi Band equipped. And omg, he'll never actually have his stats capped lolz if he loses stats when he has the demiband lolz.

Muriam kicks butt, *covers eyes* PUT BACK ON GEOF'S SHIRT!

You know you like it.

[Linkhasafan]

If Tormod isn't that good, what about Zihark? He's PLANTY good on the battle field, making him a good choice for support.

No offense but, any Sage can wield a Staff. It's just right. I used Soren more then I used Rhys. In fact, I used Mist more then I used Rhys! Rhys is too vunreble. Muriam can kick his butt, even when he comes with the band, lol. So BEXPing Muriam a little isn't that bad. It's like BEXPing Rolf. BEXP Rolf a little, let Rolf do the rest, BAM you have the best archer in the game. Muriam may not be the best laguz, but he surely can kick butt! Besides, the REALLY good laguz don't come intill the end, like Ranulf..Wait that's it besides the royals you almost get to never use

Besides that, no of your stuff doesn't make sense, so it's not worth debating about. And BTW, you made Geof take off her shirt so you can stare at her in her bra >_>